Ponderance

[webbgirl]

When I entered fandom years ago (not as many years as some of you, but years nonetheless) I was taught that Gen fic meant that the storyline of the fic could concievably happen within the show (or whatever source material).

If that's the case, does that mean that most Torchwood crack!fic is actually Gen?

And when two characters are together in the show (whether it's a hetero or gay coupling) does a fic with them go into the Gen category or should it still get sorted into Het or Slash?

Or is my definition completely wrong?

I swear my brain will start working properly again someday. I will have intelligent thinky thoughts at some point. Today is not that day though.

Comments

[slb44.livejournal.com]

As far as I'm concerned, and I go back lots of years in fandom, Gen is, as you say, something that could be shot, just is as an episode of the show. Therefore if a couple is gay on the show, there'd be no slash fic, it'd all be gen. Likewise if they had Sam and Jack boffing like rabbits on SG-1 then that'd be gen, rated adult more then likely, but still gen.

Of course it seems like ninety percent of fandom disagrees with me on these definitions but I figure I'm old enough and fiesty enough to stick with to my guns and tell them to go play in another sand box. ;-)

[webbgirl.livejournal.com]

I could pretty much go either way with the whole thing, but what sparked the thought in my brain was the thought of all of the Sam/Jack fics that I used to see in the Gen category after the whole 'incident' in Season 4. I just wonder how many folks would be okay with a pairing like Jack/Ianto turning up as Gen.

I mean it's not as likely to be an issue in a fandom like Torchwood, but I was thinking about what would happen if a canonically gay couple turned up somewhere like SG:A (I'm just pulling that out as an example). Would fandom overall be as accepting of that couple being written into Gen fics?

[medie]

Like I said in my comment, it's all really in the focus. If the story is *ABOUT* a couple, then it's definitely a pairing fic be it het or slash. If the couple just gets a passing mention? Gen.

Like if I wrote a story about Rodney and Sheppard trapped on a planet and Rodney grumbles about missing the party the Athosians were throwing for a couple Canadian soldiers' anniversary. That'd be gen. Heck a story *AT* said party would still be gen. But if the story was about the guys/girls themselves in the romantic sense, I'd probably err on the side of caution and categorize it as slash. If only for making it easier to find for the fans who want to read it.

[webbgirl.livejournal.com]

*nods* Very understandable.

I know that there's nothing hard and fast when it comes to fandom. Definitions tend to be fluid for everything. I'm just curious as to how far off my thoughts/understanding of these things are from other folks.

[medie]

*nods* I think we're starting to hit a point really where the labels really are more for the convenience of finding a genre that you want to read. I know people who avoid het as rabidly as some people avoid slash and being that I write pretty much everything, knowing I've got they're on my friends list, I tag it with the genres. Really, these days, in my head there's pretty much two classifications. Gen = no romance and pairingfic = which means even if there's a plot, it's still about a particular pairing and that's het/slash/femslash. BUT since people aren't in my head *G* I go with what they'll recognize.

It is amazing to see how far some people's opinions differ from others. I mean, I'd NEVER not list pairing or genre for my fics but I saw someone on a supernatural comm tag a fic as gen. wincest. Which to me made next to *NO* sense. *G*

[webbgirl.livejournal.com]

*hee* I've seen some gen fics get labled like that and I just boggle.

I think we're starting to hit a point really where the labels really are more for the convenience of finding a genre that you want to read.

It's kind of like warnings for me. I use them more to hunt for a specific type of fic that I'm looking for rather than what to avoid. *g*

[slb44.livejournal.com]

Well imho Jack/Ianto is Gen, from what I've seen. *g*

I think crossover fics offer up a whole 'nother problem though. If it's canon on one show and not on another I'd lean towards canon=gen for both, but the fans might take offence. Then again why would they read a Torchwood X SGA fic if they don't like what's happening on Torchwood?

Of course knowing SGA as we do, fandom_wank would get a good work out over that story. ;-)

[nialla]

Technically, yes, gen is defined as something that could be on the show, but I still prefer to use Het or Slash designations for stories that refer to any pairing together even if they're canon.

My reason for that is I don't want to read something labeled as "gen" and find out it's a hetfic. And for my hetfic reading friends, I don't want them reading a genfic and find it loaded with slash either. Gen to my mind is (and I don't mean this in a bad way) generic, not focused on romance at all, even if it is something used as part of the official storyline.

There are some fics that use both het and slash in one story, which can confuse matters even further. My own SG-1 parodies are listed in the gen section of the archive, because there's het and slash jokes in there, but that's mentioned in the notes. At least I'm an equal opportunity offender. ;)

[webbgirl.livejournal.com]

See my response above for most of my thoughts.

I get what you're saying about the 'not focused on romance' part and I kind of lean towards liking that definition because it just seems more egalitarian to me.

Part of what sparked this was thinking about the number of gen fic that I've started reading that turned out to be het fic with the authors vehemently arguing that because they'd made googly eyes at each other on the show it counted as gen.

Thinking about this kind of makes me want to do a follow-up post on my thoughts on "pre-slash" and rating systems.

[nialla]

My canon might not be someone else's canon. It's always interesting to see how fans interpret events differently, such as some who vehemently said that Daniel was only Jack's delusion in Abyss, or even if they admitted he was there to help Jack, he most certainly did not spark the idea that rescued Jack.

While a case can be made for both sides, TPTB have said they intended for Daniel to be there and he did provide the spark. But does that make it canon? If so, then apparently the military is just peachy with "co-command" because TPTB were roasting that chestnut at the beginning of season nine. So could one or more of TPTB saying a ship was intended but can't be shown outright make it canon?

Which is a long way around of saying that just because there's goo-goo eyes onscreen (in the opinion of the writer, at least) doesn't mean it's a canon romance. Even in the cases of canon romance, such as John/Aeryn on Farscape or Wash/Zoe in Firefly, I still want it listed as het and not gen. Just as if I'm reading Jack/Ianto, I want it listed as slash.

It's not just in fanfic where this is an issue. There's a lot of debate in Libary Land about labeling genre fiction. Some advocate no labeling at all, while others feel a spine label showing the genre is beneficial to those seeking a particular genre.

Then you have cases where a genre is shelved separately, which was done long before I was here for mysteries. So then you have cases where an author writes primarily mysteries, then writes something that's not a mystery, so where do you put it? Do you try to keep it all together or split the shelving according to genre?

[medie]

*snicker*

The gen definition I use is "very minimal romantic pairings" so if you have like a Torchwood case file where Jack is, well, Jack in the way he is on the show? Can concievably considered Gen. (Cause let's face it, the boy doesn't do sexless) Though I have seen pairingless stories in TW with the traditional sense of Gen.

[malnpudl.livejournal.com]

I'm with Nialla. As far as I'm concerned, "gen" means that any pairings that may exist are not the focus of the story. If a character is married or in a relationship in canon, fine, there may be incidental references to that relationship within the fic, but nothing more than that.

If the focus of the story is the pairing or the relationship, then it's either "het" or "slash" (or both). Doesn't matter whether it's canon or not.

I'd be thoroughly cranky if I read something labelled "gen" and it was laden with sex or romance, regardless of what sort.

[webbgirl.livejournal.com]

I'd be thoroughly cranky if I read something labelled "gen" and it was laden with sex or romance, regardless of what sort.

The more I think about it, the more I tend to lean that way. Though, frankly reading fic by an author I'm not familiar with is always a crapshoot anyway. *g*

[spikedluv]

For me, Gen = no romantic pairing. That's the way I've seen it defined for purposed of achiving and awards, and that's the definition I use for my awards.